+- Australian Ham Radio Discussion Forum ( AHRDF ) (https://www.ahrdf.net/forum)
+-- Forum: GENERAL (https://www.ahrdf.net/forum/forum-29.html)
+--- Forum: General Discussion (https://www.ahrdf.net/forum/forum-9.html)
+--- Thread: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 (/thread-712.html)
Pages:
1
2
VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 25-01-2019
The following was copied from the current VKLogger Forum about the basic Logger functionality:
"
Like I have been saying for years, the VK Logger coding is old, circa 2003.
The entire site needs replacing.
It has been held together with gaffer tape and string for too many years!
Comments above just reaffirm how antiquated the VK Logger scripting really is.
Moving forward, it simply not good enough anymore.
NOBODY in two years has come forward to volunteer to build a replacement, as has been asked many times.
Whether it ends up here on vklogger.com or a completely new domain, that's up to you, but we can work together to ensure the existing VKL data can be imported into your new site.
There is a difference between chat only (KST) and a site that actually saves information on database tables, so that historical information becomes useful.
Like I have also been saying since early 2017, VK Logger is on 'End of life'.
The two other (Wordpress based) domains that share this server have required a later version of php (minimum 5.6) to run some of the plugins.
I have had to deliberately keep this shared server on an old version of php, 5.3 for some time now.
Up until recently, not updating the plugins of the other sites only affected cosmetics, something I could tolerate.
But this situation has changed recently due to security vulnerabilities.
Therefore, VK Logger will cease to operate from March 25, 2019.
March 25 being the 14th anniversary date... no other reason.
It is a compromise between ASAP and offering some advance notice of cessation.
This forum will continue to operate after the 'php switch', and in fact I will be able to upgrade the Forum to a later version (that also required a later version on php to operate).
The domain name was renewed this week till March 25, 2020.
Renewal beyond that will be determined by how much the Forum is utilised.
If it aint worth running anymore, it aint worth running anymore.
Now, before the moaning and complaining starts, consider this.
This 'end of life' status has been announced many times on the VHF Facebook group.
What?
You missed that?
But some people think Facebook is the best thing since sliced bread?
That must be the only reason we see so people post so much on Facebook on a daily basis, when a Forum would be more suitable for longevity and searchability ?
As it stands there are two options:
Option 1)
The easy (read as: lazy) way is move across to KST chat.
Minimal effort required.
You will have a basic chat facility that only stores the chat for 2 weeks (or whatever it is).
No integrated mapping.
No long term database back-end.
No interactive beacon and repeater databases kept updated by spots.
Perhaps most people do not value this extra functionality?
Option 2)
Somebody passionate needs to get cracking and start coding, and start building!
Bear in mind, I knew nothing about php or MySQL etc when I started building VK Logger in 2003.
I learnt along the way.
Therefore, there are NO excuses why any existing user cannot take this task on.
(Unless you have a genuine learning disability.)
The only prerequisite is that you are passionate about the hobby.
And no, moving VK Logger as-is back onto on a stand-alone hosting is not an option.
The only reason VK Logger has kept operating since 2016 is because it was moved to 'piggyback' on another domain, not a costing anything extra to host.
(The business website is an unavoidable expense anyway)
And no, accepting donations is not option either.
Several nasty individuals (who have a history of dummy spits and chose to use KST exclusively) put an end to accepting donations in early 2016.
It's simply not worth dealing with nut cases and their unreasonable demands.
Demands, if not met, result in dummy spits and tantrums.
Been there, done that.
Moving forward, if someone shows me a working site, we can properly discuss data migration etc.
It would be a terrible shame to waste 13 years worth of data collection.
Apathy?
VK Logger Administrator
"
A further post explains some more of the background....
"
Quote:VK7HH wrote:I think you misunderstood the reason for my original posting...
Haden, it seemed an appropriate time to officially mention the scheduled closure date.
Nothing more, nothing less.
I have had other recent (via direct messaging) messages regarding issues with seeing Google Map elements.
In other words, it's a common problem for many, not just those who have posted in this topic.
The DX Path mapping issues were another major driver in closing down VK Logger.
I had to create a Google billing account recently and jump through all sorts of hoops to keep the old (obsolete since 2016) DX Path map going.
The DX Path Map scripting is more complicated (than the maps found elsewhere ie; beacon, repeater and history pages which were updated with new mapping API back in 2016), because of the AJAX data feeding into it along with sun positioning, and equatorial band.
Quote:VK7HH wrote:I would be more inclined for an "upgrade" or a rebuild though as most of the backend seems to be the issue correct? The front end is just fine.
There are too many band aids as it is.
Trust me, it needs a complete re-write.
Quote:VK7HH wrote:... you've invested too much time in the Logger to consider just shutting it down.
Yes, but I have emotionally detached myself from the hobby over recent years.
Quote:VK7HH wrote:I'd have to read back through some of the posts, but have you lost interest in it? Lost interest in amateur radio?
I've been QRT since April 2014.
The lack of local VHF and microwave activity and the overwhelming levels of apathy killed my interest.
Quote:VK7HH wrote:From the tone of your post it seems like you've just about had your tether with the individuals who have caused issues relating to the logger... Sometimes you need to look at the bigger picture and realize that the appreciative ones outweigh the haters.
Except when the haters outweigh the appreciative.
"
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 26-01-2019
I have been thinking about the outcome of Adam's post and what it will mean to the current users of VKLogger. I won't be learning to write code in yet another language but will offer an intermediate service if people want to use it to "chat".
In brief, I am offering just some chat rooms for General, Spots, 6M, 2M/70CM, Microwave and Digital Modes (more are possible..). Nothing fancy, no extended logging, no distances / mapping / grids support, simply a temporary replacement for the IChat function currently available on VKLogger and based on the Blab! AX free package. Message history will be about 3 weeks.
If I had a spare $100 then I would upgrade to the Blab! AX Pro version which (so I read) integrates with the MYBB that this forum runs on - but since I don't, chat users will need to register and log in separately (it's a painless process). That may change if it gets significant use.
The software has been set up at https://www.ahrdf.net/chat/ for you to try.
Please respond with any comments either to this post, direct email or by PM.
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK2KRR - 26-01-2019
I've been using the KST chat, region 3, 144 MHz for a number of years now after realising I could no longer support the use of the VK Logger, for reasons the casual observer may not have noticed.
KST Chat is just that, a chat page, there is no logging of contacts there. Most people use DX Maps pages for logging contacts, the contacts on DX Maps also show up in the KST chat cluster spots area, there is also a map integrated which shows the spots, you just have to know how to set it all up. But it can be customised to how one likes it. So you would use DX Maps for reporting contacts if you need to log them and the KST pages for chatting and alerts.
Our AIS and WSPR spots are automatically aggregated to the DX Maps pages to give the observer more of an idea of whats happening, as well as spots which are manually entered by people for QSOs.
Regarding Facebook, you can search for past information on facebook pages no problems. Its interesting that Facebook is even mentioned when originally the logger had a message up the top of the Logger pages warning users that basically you would have to be stupid to use Facebook. Interesting how thats changed.
I've been told there are some people working on a replacement version of the logger, but I dont know more than that.
I'll have a look at the chat page when I get a chance, but not sure its really required, but will have a look.
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK6RO - 26-01-2019
Gday Doug..
I remember you set up a chat thingy in the past when vklogger shut down?
I think i remember using it..
I found a link to it somewhere in a browser a few weeks ago .. i think..
What is this "face" thing people speak of?
It would be very nice to have a chat thing for all to use.
cheers and thank you for this forum
vk6ro 26 1 2019
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 26-01-2019
I did set up a chat a couple of years ago (??) but I am not even sure what software I used for it. The forum is running on a shared server so I have to be circumspect as to what software is used security-wise - this one is free and the server is already available to the forum. It may undergo some customisation in due course (it's PHP-based so it is possible, & MYSQL for storage), the unknown awaits !
All I am offering is a quick alternative chat option because when Adam shuts his service down on March 25th, there is no local group alternative. If someone writes new VKLogger-like code, I would be keen to see it and possibly arrange to have it hosted in lieu of this chat.
I don't use Facebook ( actually I do have an account that I log into maybe every 6 months or so) yet many think it is the best thing around. I don't.
I don't think it is really suited to 'chat' even if history is available.
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK2ZIW - 28-01-2019
Hi Doug,
I can't "write" code but I can maintain. (My VentraIP site is idle.) Can it be used?
I noticed, today, VKLOGGER is a new site without the needed liaison section.
How can I do Meteor Scatter this morning etc..?
I only looked at this forum today after three months concentrating on Codec2.
Alan VK2ZIW
Hi all,
ON4KST chat may be a good thing but is it hosted in Australia?
Is this the "dumming down" of our hobby, all the expertise overseas.
This is what I'm doing:
http://www.unixservice.com.au/hamradio/repeaters/duplexers/basics.html
Alan VK2ZIW
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 28-01-2019
Alan
My idea was to provide an alternative to the likes of 'KST' Chat when the VKLogger chat disappears. Multi-Room. No real bells. No real whistles.
Yes, AHRDF.NET is hosted in Australia. Currently hosted in a Sydney datacentre with a Brisbane NBN node as a cold backup.
If you visit the Chat link provided previously, there you will see Digital Modes chatroom which would be ideal for MS liaison. I could make a specific room just for MS if it came to that, or a new room for any other specific use, if the demand was there.
The major issue is to advise all VK / ZL / ... amateurs that a chat option is available here before - and after - the 25th March 2019. That is the difficult bit.
I don't even have to integrate the current chat software support into this Forum although doing so would make it harder for spammers or illicit users to access to post their rubbish. Integration would mean that only registered Forum users would be able to access the chat rooms by using their Forum credentials. Forum registration is relatively easy - though not instantaneous - so one shouldn't try to get a login activated 5 minutes before sked times.
'Dumbing down' is best reserved for another topic.
Re your VentraIP hosting offer, a good alternative if our current Forum hosting expires.
Doug
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 11-02-2019
Today I made a point of posting that there was a simple chat option available on this domain name on the VKLogger Forum against the thread "http://www.vklogger.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=13813&start=20" so users there would be informed of its existence.
What I had a little chuckle at was that Adam VK4GHZ subsequently removed my post entirely this afternoon then put up his own text and then locked the topic.
Obviously he doesn't want anyone to know that there is an alternative chat option while the VKLogger iChat function is "re-created".
He posted:
"There are currently five, yes five, people (that I know of) who have indicated they are attempting to create a "replacement".
Only two of these five bothered to contact me regarding any advice I can pass on, functionality, and eventually data migration/hand-over.
These two creators, who wish to remain anonymous, have had the various SQL table structures for a number of weeks to help assist fast-track their projects.
Only one of these will get all the historical data, to prevent an obvious idiotic situation.
This thread is going to be closed off in the meantime, until the replacement(s) is/are ready for live testing.
Stay tuned."
There was no real need to remove my post, nor to lock the topic.
Unfortunately I don't have a copy of my post else I would post it here.
I guess I will have to write the info up as an item for the WIA News - he can't censor that...
PS I have posted on VKLogger forum again under a new topic : http://www.vklogger.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=13854&p=63040#p63040
It will be interesting to see if it stays or is deleted.....
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK3ALB - 11-02-2019
I think the chat feature is the least important part of what most folks call VKlogger. The tools that Adam created are unique and more impressive than most of the logging tools I have seen.
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 11-02-2019
Lou
I agree in part with that but over many years users have used the iChat function to coordinate for unusual mode QSOs, place comments etc. I was one of those users for quite a long time so know its usefulness for that purpose. If I was more active on-air on 6 / 2 / 70 / 23 /+ then I would probably still be using it - a lot.
To others following the topic:
I clicked on my link to VKLogger as per my previous post : The requested topic does not exist.
This was the post there :
"http://www.vklogger.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=13854&p=63040#p63040
I have been thinking about the outcome of Adam's post about the VKLogger End-of-Life and what it will mean to the current users of VKLogger. I won't be learning to write code in yet another language but will offer an intermediate service if people want to use it to "chat".
In brief, I am offering just some chat rooms for General, Spots, 6M/ 2M, 70CM / Microwave and Digital Modes (more are possible..). Nothing fancy, no extended logging, no distances / mapping / grids support, simply a temporary replacement for the IChat function currently available on VKLogger and based on the Blab! AX free package. Message history will be about 3 weeks.
If I had a spare $100 then I would upgrade to the Blab! AX Pro version which (so I read) integrates with the MYBB that the AHRDF forum runs on - but since I don't, chat users will need to register and log in separately (it's a painless process). That may change if it gets significant use.
The software has been set up at https://www.ahrdf.net/chat/ for you to try.
Doug VK4ADC
PS Let's see if this topic gets deleted like my last post about this - on the forum that is "Free & open for all ham radio enthusiasts"
"
Well it didn't last long on the Free & open for all ham radio enthusiasts" forum. An hour or less.
I acknowledge that admins have the ultimate control of what is posted on their forums but what was posted was not objectionable, obscene etc.. so there was no reason to remove it.
I make a point of NOT removing posts but I sometimes make minor changes to the wording - but not the overall context represented. No real censoring takes place, just tidying. And, I don't delete others' posts..
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 25-02-2019
Oh dear, I seem to have upset Adam again:
http://www.vklogger.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=45&t=13813&start=20
"There are currently five, yes five, people (that I know of) who have indicated they are attempting to create a "replacement".
Only two of these five bothered to contact me regarding any advice I can pass on, functionality, and eventually data migration/hand-over.
These two creators, who wish to remain anonymous, have had the various SQL table structures for a number of weeks to help assist fast-track their projects.
Only one of these will get all the historical data, to prevent an obvious idiotic situation.
This thread is going to be closed off in the meantime, until the replacement(s) is/are ready for live testing.
Stay tuned.
ps
Anyone attempting to provide a chat only system is clearly oblivious to KST Chat, which would be counter productive in fragmenting an already declining pool of users."
Well I am not oblivious to the ON4KST Chat but IF the replacement for the VKLogger iChat does not get off the ground by the nominal 25th March 2019, what facility are VK & ZL users going to use for local coordination ? Even just some local chat like I saw on the iChat window a few minutes ago ?? Would other users world-wide want that clogging up KST ? Probably not.
The simple chat rooms on AHRDF.NET are a temporary facility that were implemented to provide for the absence of iChat (or its replacement) but I am half tempted to leave them as a permanent facility. Certainly there have only been a handful of users logged into this chat so far but it is the user's choice as to whether to utilise it or something else (provided that something else still exists)..
Do I care if it doesn't get used ?? No, not really. If people use it then it uses a little of the monthly internet bandwidth allocation but costs no more, no less.
That "declining pool" gets to make their own choice.
I can't post these comments against the VKLogger thread because it is locked off but probably at least one AHRDF forum user will copy and paste into an email to Adam..
P.S. Oh yeah, my ego is pretty well under control.
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK2KRR - 25-02-2019
Thanks for all your efforts Doug.
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4BLP - 25-02-2019
More the question is "if vklogger is going to dump his chat option, then why can't someone else fill the gap ?"
Seems that someone should take it on, as I hear it is quite useful for some.
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 08-03-2019
( From: WIA NATIONAL NEWS FOR WEEK COMMENCING Mar 10 2019 )
Doug VK4ADC sent us a reminder that according to the VKLogger Forum under the topic "Chat and Logger display / END OF LIFE" dated 16th December 2018, there are only a few weeks left before the stated cessation date of 25th March 2019.
VKLogger Forum itself is continuing after that date.
Development of replacement Chat and Spotting code is reported to be in process but may, or may not, be ready by the 25th March. Generic chatrooms for general discussion, plus VHF and above, have been created as an add-on to the Australian Ham Radio Discussion Forum on the AHRDF.NET web site as an alternative chat facility.
These chatrooms do not have the Spots function of VKLogger but can be used by amateurs for coordination and general discussion.
Registration for the Chat facility is quick and easy and access is via your browser at ahrdf.net/chat That web address again is A H R D F dot NET slash CHAT while the related Forum is at A H R D F dot NET Amateur radio operators worldwide are invited to join and use either facility.
(also cross-posted under "AHRDF Chat" topic)
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 21-03-2019
Spotted at the top of the VKLogger page this afternoon :
Looks like it is happening...
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4WDM - 21-03-2019
I am going to miss it. I have been alerted to hundreds of VHF band openings by it over the years. Also spotted a lot of rare HF DX.
Wayne VK4WDM
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 25-03-2019
It seems HF is gone and 6M is next..
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK4ADC - 31-03-2019
I noted the following paragraph in the VHF/UHF notes (Page 52) by Kevin VK4UH in the March/April Amateur Radio magazine (Volume 87 Issue 2 for 2019) :
"And first some good news to start this month’s report. As most regular VHF operators were aware the VHF-Logger, a service most of us had come to rely upon, is reaching end of life. After many revisions and updates, over many years, the end of the tunnel is in sight and lights were off. The imminent loss of this invaluable service has prompted a group response from the VKZL community. I am delighted to advise that a completely new and fully modelled application, to take the place of the VHF-Logger, has been created by a group of writers and is now at an advanced stage of testing before general release. More information will follow and it is hoped that all of the historical archived data and information stored within the old logger will be available in due course within the new application."
No obvious signs as yet... @ 31 March 2019
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - VK2WP - 31-03-2019
Shall wait and see what transpires.
RE: VKLogger - End of Life - 25 March 2019 - ZL3MF - 01-04-2019
Still seems to be running and the closure date has come and gone, Does anyone have any updates to what is happening?
